as Philippians 2:9-11 and Colossians 1:16-17 to discover that the JWs have
deliberately inserted the word "other" into the text. This was done primarily to avoid
the implication these passages have in accurately understanding the true nature and
person of Christ. The NWT translation committee seemingly knew that these passages
clearly teach that Jesus is Yahweh God, the Creator of all things and could not
therefore be the first creation of God. Hence, in order to avoid this they willfully
manhandled God's Word to suit their theological presuppositions.
Reply: Uhm, when I mentioned Augustine, it actually had some bearing on what we were talking about. How does the word "other" fit into this?
Let us take a look at your assumptions of the word "other" in Php 2:
"God...gave him the name that is above every [other]name." NWT
"God...gave him a name that is above every other name." New Living Translation
"God...has given Him the name that is above every other name." CB Williams NT
"God...gave Him the name that is above every other name. Beck
"God...gave him the name which is above all other names." New Jerusalem Bible
"God...gave him the name that is greater than any other name." Good News Bible
"God has...given him that name which is greater than any other name." Knox Bible
"God...has conferred on Him the Name which is supreme above every other." Weymouth NT
"God...gave him the Name which stands above all other names." 20th Century NT
"God...giving him a name that is above every other name." 21st Century NT
"God has...given him the name above all others. Smith&Goodspeed's An American Translation
"God...gave him the name which is above all other names." Jerusalem Bible
"God...gave him a name which is above every other name." Living Bible
"God made the name of Christ greater than every other name." New Century Version
"God...gave Him a name that is greater than any other name." New Life Study Testament
"God has given him...the name honored above all other names." God's Word Bible
Do not these translators "understand the true nature and person of Christ" according to some?
The reason for the insertion of the word "other" (and you have to notice that the NWT is the only one that actually has it in brackets), as 1 Corinthians shows, is that God is excluded by the word "ALL."
"In that quotation All things are put under him, it is evident that God is excepted, who put all things under Him." 1 Cor 15:27 Montgomery NT [emphasis hers]
Commenting on this, John V. Dahms points out,
"I submit that a responsible reading of Philippians 2 finds the doctrine of the eternal subordination of the Son implied in it. AS J.J. Muller has said in commenting on this text: 'The glorification of the Father is the ultimate purpose of all things.'" The Subordination of the Son, JETS, September 1994, 351-64Moises Silva adds, "EIS DOXAN QEOU PATROS: Clearly, the worship of Jesus as Lord does not imply competition with the Father, who receives even greater glory through the glorification of the Son." p. 133, The Wycliffe Exegetical Commentary
This leads us to Colossians 1:16.
E. Lohse, "A Commentary on the Epistles to the Colossians and to Philemon", (The Hermeneia Series) p. 50, note 125 says: "It should be noted that EN (in), DIA (through), and EIS (for) are used, but not EK (from). 'From whom are all things' ( EX hOU TA PANTA) is said of God in 1 Corinthians 8:6. He is and remains the creator, but the pre-existent Christ is the mediator of creation."
The Son is never called "creator", but he is what Robertson calls "the intermediate agent" According to Robertson (Grammar p. 820) the source (direct agent) is most commonly expressed by the Greek preposition hUPO ("by"), and sometimes by APO ("from") and EK ("out of"). The intermediate agent is often identified by DIA ("through"). Matthew 1:22 points this out nicely: "All this took place because what was spoken [aorist passive participle] by [ hUPO] the Lord through [DIA] the prophet must be fulfilled [aorist passive subjunctive]." Here "the Lord" is the source and "the prophet" is the intermediate agent. In John 1:3 we read " Through (DIA) him all things were made." In Colossians 1:16 we read: "For by (EN) him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by (DIA) him and for (EIS) him. " Please note that the verbs are passive and note the use of prepositions. In the verse we find the preposition EN ("in," "by means of"). This preposition governs AUTW ("him," in the dative case). Most of the 74 occurrences in the NT of EN AUTW in the dative case are locative, that is, they refer to something or someone being in some place. Only one of the examples points to a source. In the last part of verse 16 we find the preposition DIA which governs AUTOU in the genitive case. This is the typical marking of an intermediate agent, so this must be the proper way to view the Son in this context. God is the source of the passive verbs which speak about creation, and that the Son is the intermediate agent? In Colossians 1:12 "the Father" is mentioned, and he is active through verse 20. This is seen in verse 19 where God is the implied subject for the verb, and it is particularly evident in verse 20, because here both the source (God) and the intermediate agent (Jesus) are mentioned. It is said that the reconciliation is "through" (DIA) Jesus and "to" (EIS) God. The same thought is expressed in verse 22. The implied source (grammatical subject) of the active verb "reconciled" is "God." The intermediate agent is Jesus, for it is said that reconciliation occurred "by means of" (EN) his fleshly body and "through" (DIA) his death.
Even Robert H Countess, though no friend of the NWT, had the following interesting remarks:
"Even though Liddell-Scott state that the radical sense of DIA is 'through' there can be produced instances where the genetive appears to be causal and the accusative to signify agency. In general this writer would observe that the so-called causal uses of DIA seem to be inextricably linked with agency (i.e. 'by' or 'through').It is interesting that even Countess has to concede that Christ is the agent of creation, and, as a parallel, uses Acts 3:18, denoting a separate body/being as agent.
For example, one lexicon cites as causal John 1:3-DI AUTOU EGENETO. [cf. Col. 1:16-TA PANTA DI AUTOU KAI EIS AUTON EKTISTAI.] God apparently worked *through* the Son in creating all things and, therefore, the Son Himself in some sense *caused* or created. Another example given is Acts 3:18- O DE QEOS A PROKATHGGEILEN DIA STOMATOS PANTWN TWN PROFHTWN. Here the mouth of all the prophets is the channel or medium *through which* God announced beforehand the sufferings of Christ. The prophets indeed *caused* the message to be proclaimed but only inasmuch as their mouths had been selected as channels or media for the divine communication." THANK GOD FOR THE GENETIVE, Robert H. Countess, p. 118, JETS, Spring 1969
So, yes you can translate the following without violating anything:
"It was he that formed all other things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible. Whether kingdoms or dominions, governments or authorities, all came into existence as a result of him and by means of him." 21st Century NTKeep in mind that God is exempted from "all things" 1 Cor 15:27, and when you think about, Jesus is also exempted from the creative process with the wording "other" in the NWT. You would think that this is something Trinitarians would like. People do bring up Scriptures where Jehovah says he created alone.
We know that Jehovah, was not really alone at the time of creation because Job 38:6, 7 tells us: "When I laid the foundation of the earth ... all the sons of God shouted for joy". The angels shouted for joy when Jehovah, through His Son, "laid the foundations of the earth".
We see also that the created Wisdom (Jesus) was helping god during creation creation,
"when he marked out the foundations of the earth, then I was beside him, like a master workman (ftn. little child)." Prov 8:22-30 RSV
The use of the term, "alone", "by myself" etc do not necessarily mean the same thing to those in power, even in the Bible. What do I mean?
Let us look at Daniel 4:30 and Isaiah 63:3. Daniel 4:30, "The king reflected and said, 'Is this not Babylon the great, which I myself have built.' " NASB.
"The king was saying, 'Great Babylon! Imperial palace! Did I not build it alone.' " Jerusalem Bible.
"The king spake and said, Is this not Babylon the great, - which I myself have built," J.B. Rotherham
Nebuchadnezzar was not the only person to have built Babylon, was he? But it was built by his authority, his word and no other's.
Isaiah 63:3 says: "I [Jehovah] have trodden the wine press alone, and of the peoples there was no man with me." Again, it was not Jehovah who personally punish these people. It was His angel acting on the Jehovah's authority. (2 Kings 19:35, 36) Did Jehovah personally chastise the Babylonians or did He use the Medes and Perians to accomplish His will? (Daniel 5:26-28, 30-31) All these acts were done by Jehovah's authority; and by His alone.—Ezekiel. 36:33, 36.
But this again, is where agency comes in. Nave's Topical Bible rightly says under *Worship,* "to be rendered to God only."
Yet, the worship to God (Shachah, OT), is again, contrasted between Jehovah and the false idol gods.
Ex 20:3-4, " Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image..."
Ex 34:14, 17 "for thou shalt worship no other god: for Jehovah, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God...Thou shalt make thee no molten gods."
...and interestingly, Deut 29:26, "and went and served other gods, and worshipped them, gods that they knew not, and that he had not given unto them."
It is of no small note that the Bible also uses the same word (Shachah) used in exclusive WORSHIP to Jehovah, to others as well.
"Then the king Nebuchadnezzar fell upon his face, and worshipped Daniel" Dan 2:46 KJV, RV, ASV
"And all the congregation blessed the LORD God of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped the LORD, and the king." 1Chron 29:20 KJV, ASV
Here, king David is given the same worship as Jehovah.
An angel even receives worship (NKJV, ASV) at Joshua 5:13-15 c.f.Ex. 23:23.
Angels were even allowed to use God's name. In Exodus 3:2 [Acts 7:30-32], "the angel of Jehovah appeared unto him [Moses] in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush" Ex. 3:2. Yet later on we read that this same angel used the name Jehovah for himself [v. 16], even the "I AM"[v.14] you find so important to your theology. As Ex 23:20, 21 says,
"Behold, I send an angel before thee, to keep thee by the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Take ye heed before him, and hearken unto his voice; provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgression: for my name is in him."
So as representatives of God, angels were allowed to use his name, and to act as God. You will find other examples of angels in similar situations at Gen 16:13, 21:17; 22:15,16; 31:11, 13, Jg 6:12, 13, 14, 20, 21, 22, 23; 13:6, 21, and Deut 5:24.
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